Cass, there is indeed light at the end of the tunnel. I really liked your thoughtful commentary. The essence of your response mirrors the struggle between civilizations that is really at the core of this idealogical battle. If we want to be sure we are not swallowed up by our blind acceptance of diverse ideas for the sake of being diverse, sensitive, and “tolerant” we must wake up to the concept that intellectual strength is needed; not compassionate bipartinsin bleating about equal acceptance of every idea. Giving every argument defference and equal weight is a recipe for cultural oblivion.
“very serious issues brought out here have been subsumed by the Christian religious preacher, the liberal basher, the Muslim hater, et. al.”
Everyone who disagrees with you is a hater, basher, preacher, racist.. I get it.
I am simply arguing I disagree with liberalism in its very premise. Furthermore I do not believe we were historically established by people of liberalism. (Mainly because, then, people did not have the luxury to consider it)
That said: I think YOU are missing “very serious issue” at its core. That is, the ideological differences & failures we have as a society which allowed us to dissolve our national identity.
That is why this is MORE than argument about a mosque. Not meerly politicizing or “bashing” the minority options expressed here.
P.S I don’t think the word subsumed was used correctly by a previous poster.. but maybe I’m wrong. Can someone double check me? :)
Thanks…you get it. Arthur, J, and Donovan…you miss the point. When we are bashing each other, we lose sight of a lot of the real discourse over very serious issues.
If I am prochoice, do you really think you will change my mmind? If I tend to be liberal in what I expect should be given rights and privileges to our fellow citizens, do you really think Rand Paul is going to change my mind? If you call yourself conservative, and I call myself a liberal, are we really so different in what we ultimately (when we get down to specifics) want for our country, our families and oursleves? What you call “liberal” and I call “conservative” don’t even come close to what the original definitions of these terms were; they have been twisted and perverted by politicians seeking cheap shots; demagogues primising bread and circuses, and a media that is more Hollywood than what Walter Cronkite and Edward R Murrow ever dreamed. The American public seems to have the attention span of a gnat, when Lindsay Lohan or Paris Hilton’s latest dust up with the police is considered more newsworthy than our dead soldiers in Afghanistan….
I grieve for us.
So let’s stop the name calling and bashing and look at the serious issues I tried to bring out and apparently Tom was the only one that caught on. We are ALL citizens here (I assume) and in the same boat.
Tom is absolutely right; it is time to dispense with politically correct groveling and get down to the real issues of how many immigrants should be allowed here, how far we will bend to accommodate their “culture” and what will we do if Muslims want sharia? As I said, we already have a history of accommodation to certain religious/cultural groups….so how far do we go?
As far as the NY mosque is concerned, I personally would burn in hellfire before I would allow it there if I were dictator (can you still paint ALL liberals with the same brush after that statement?)…but I am not dictator and since I want the same freedoms afforded to me I cannot deny these constitutional right to others. This Imam certainly knows better and certainly knows how he is inflaming us; I do not think his motives are to promote universal understanding despite what he says (I am trying to use nice words but can you feel the sarcasm?) And he may be involved with worse…I don’t know…but he is “within his rights.”
This country needs a new vision that most all can share. after WWII we had the glow of “saving the world” and American “can do” spirit that we all bought into or our parents did. We could do anything…put a man on the moon, make the world “safe for democracy,” bring down the walls of Berlin. Now we are losing our way. That writers in these blogs can’t even be civilized and civil to each other is merely a symptom of that.
Until the left is able to call a spade a spade…in other words define “prochoice” as prodeath for the unborn we will continue to disagree. It’s not about choice Cassandra, it’s about life and death! You either give life to the baby inside you or you KILL it.The same applies to “undocumented immigrants” they are illegal aliens.A spade is a spade!
And HELL no this country doesn’t need a “new vision” It needs to get back to God,family,baseball and apple pie.
You STILL poersist in missing the point; we will never agree about prochoice.
That does not mean that we cannot agree about other things. The issue at hand was resistance to the TN and the NY mosque, not liberal vs. conservative or prolife vs. prochoice.
“…female students requested that men and boys be prohibitred from watching intramural sports games that these girls partidipated in since it was against their religion to be viewed by non family males. And the stupid school granted that! What about the civil rights of the husbands and brothers that wanted to see their daughters play?…”
Did I miss something? Are not husbands and brothers family males?
Arthur: Until you can carry a fetus inside you, you have no right telling anyone what they can and can not do with it. It is only opinion on whether a fetus is a baby and I say it is not. I also say, if you don’t want to have an abortion – DON’T! That is the difference between being pro-killing a baby inside you and pro-CHOICE. You can not take that choice away from me nor should you EVER have that right.
WHOA! I was just stopping back by to follow this debate and days later it’s still going!!! This is so awesome! It’s so funny what everyone has resorted to arguing about. Clearly Polly loooves to argue even though she’s so full of contradictions I just laugh at this point because who can take it seriously? Her and that Cassnadra poster. Good stuff kids.
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Did you have your baby or kill it?
Cass, there is indeed light at the end of the tunnel. I really liked your thoughtful commentary. The essence of your response mirrors the struggle between civilizations that is really at the core of this idealogical battle. If we want to be sure we are not swallowed up by our blind acceptance of diverse ideas for the sake of being diverse, sensitive, and “tolerant” we must wake up to the concept that intellectual strength is needed; not compassionate bipartinsin bleating about equal acceptance of every idea. Giving every argument defference and equal weight is a recipe for cultural oblivion.
“very serious issues brought out here have been subsumed by the Christian religious preacher, the liberal basher, the Muslim hater, et. al.”
Everyone who disagrees with you is a hater, basher, preacher, racist.. I get it.
I am simply arguing I disagree with liberalism in its very premise. Furthermore I do not believe we were historically established by people of liberalism. (Mainly because, then, people did not have the luxury to consider it)
That said: I think YOU are missing “very serious issue” at its core. That is, the ideological differences & failures we have as a society which allowed us to dissolve our national identity.
That is why this is MORE than argument about a mosque. Not meerly politicizing or “bashing” the minority options expressed here.
P.S I don’t think the word subsumed was used correctly by a previous poster.. but maybe I’m wrong. Can someone double check me? :)
Thanks…you get it. Arthur, J, and Donovan…you miss the point. When we are bashing each other, we lose sight of a lot of the real discourse over very serious issues.
If I am prochoice, do you really think you will change my mmind? If I tend to be liberal in what I expect should be given rights and privileges to our fellow citizens, do you really think Rand Paul is going to change my mind? If you call yourself conservative, and I call myself a liberal, are we really so different in what we ultimately (when we get down to specifics) want for our country, our families and oursleves? What you call “liberal” and I call “conservative” don’t even come close to what the original definitions of these terms were; they have been twisted and perverted by politicians seeking cheap shots; demagogues primising bread and circuses, and a media that is more Hollywood than what Walter Cronkite and Edward R Murrow ever dreamed. The American public seems to have the attention span of a gnat, when Lindsay Lohan or Paris Hilton’s latest dust up with the police is considered more newsworthy than our dead soldiers in Afghanistan….
I grieve for us.
So let’s stop the name calling and bashing and look at the serious issues I tried to bring out and apparently Tom was the only one that caught on. We are ALL citizens here (I assume) and in the same boat.
Tom is absolutely right; it is time to dispense with politically correct groveling and get down to the real issues of how many immigrants should be allowed here, how far we will bend to accommodate their “culture” and what will we do if Muslims want sharia? As I said, we already have a history of accommodation to certain religious/cultural groups….so how far do we go?
As far as the NY mosque is concerned, I personally would burn in hellfire before I would allow it there if I were dictator (can you still paint ALL liberals with the same brush after that statement?)…but I am not dictator and since I want the same freedoms afforded to me I cannot deny these constitutional right to others. This Imam certainly knows better and certainly knows how he is inflaming us; I do not think his motives are to promote universal understanding despite what he says (I am trying to use nice words but can you feel the sarcasm?) And he may be involved with worse…I don’t know…but he is “within his rights.”
This country needs a new vision that most all can share. after WWII we had the glow of “saving the world” and American “can do” spirit that we all bought into or our parents did. We could do anything…put a man on the moon, make the world “safe for democracy,” bring down the walls of Berlin. Now we are losing our way. That writers in these blogs can’t even be civilized and civil to each other is merely a symptom of that.
Until the left is able to call a spade a spade…in other words define “prochoice” as prodeath for the unborn we will continue to disagree. It’s not about choice Cassandra, it’s about life and death! You either give life to the baby inside you or you KILL it.The same applies to “undocumented immigrants” they are illegal aliens.A spade is a spade!
And HELL no this country doesn’t need a “new vision” It needs to get back to God,family,baseball and apple pie.
You STILL poersist in missing the point; we will never agree about prochoice.
That does not mean that we cannot agree about other things. The issue at hand was resistance to the TN and the NY mosque, not liberal vs. conservative or prolife vs. prochoice.
“…female students requested that men and boys be prohibitred from watching intramural sports games that these girls partidipated in since it was against their religion to be viewed by non family males. And the stupid school granted that! What about the civil rights of the husbands and brothers that wanted to see their daughters play?…”
Did I miss something? Are not husbands and brothers family males?
Just wondering….
Arthur: Until you can carry a fetus inside you, you have no right telling anyone what they can and can not do with it. It is only opinion on whether a fetus is a baby and I say it is not. I also say, if you don’t want to have an abortion – DON’T! That is the difference between being pro-killing a baby inside you and pro-CHOICE. You can not take that choice away from me nor should you EVER have that right.
WHOA! I was just stopping back by to follow this debate and days later it’s still going!!! This is so awesome! It’s so funny what everyone has resorted to arguing about. Clearly Polly loooves to argue even though she’s so full of contradictions I just laugh at this point because who can take it seriously? Her and that Cassnadra poster. Good stuff kids.
Where was I contradictory?