I am glad that you quit FIG. What you state is probably true. It is an epidemic and one cure to this problem is for people to understand their rights and fight for them if necessary. Each state of this union has regulations that insurance companies must abide by when it comes to operating in that state. Those laws are made to protect the consumer. Unfortunatly most consumers do not even know these types of protections exist. Your claims rep, your agent or whoever are not going to tell you these laws exist because it is not in their best interest. The quickest cure would be for insurance reform instilling laws that would effectively stop and severly punish those companies for unfair practices. Lets face it. Most or all people do not understand their policies and most policies are written so that you need a Philadelphia Lawyer to decipher them for you. That is what insurance companies count on, the fact that you really don\’t know what coverage you have. They also count on the fact that you believe they work for your best interest when the truth is they work alone for themselves and the profit. Have you ever noticed the type of car your agent drives or the adjuster drives?
For those who do or are strong willed enough to fight against the wrong doing (lowballing, etc.) in the courts, the insurance company tries to delay the court process as best it can to break the plaintiffs bank or will power. And then when that doesn\’t work they want to settle.
The response from Mr. Poe to my initial post is also true. He points out that many insurance companies do in fact treat customers, when it comes to paying claims, far less than respectful. I have found some major insurance companies with less than good complaint ratios, but Farmers (aka as many other entities) continues to be at the top of the lists.
The point . . .protect yourself. Do not let the insurance companies roll over you.
The practices you describe by your adjuster were not because he was a \”newbie\”. This insurance company is noted very well for training their claims reps to do just what he did. This is SOP for this insurance company.
Two years ago our home was destroyed by fire. My experience mirrors your\’s exactly.The claims adjuster was sent in from another state (to make it more difficult to contact, would not respond to phone calls, would not respond to e-mails (the only time he did was to tell us that he could not type which by his inability to effectively communicate was proven beyond any doubt) and would not, as required in a timely fashion, submit to a arbitration. We took this to Federal Court for a non-binding arbitration and in front of a judge these FIG idiots and their lawyers defied the judge. That will prove to be fatal for them as we head off to a jury trial. This is all because FIG would not act in good faith.
The problem with Farmers is just not in California or Texas alone but all across the United States. A search of state by state insurance complaints puts Farmers at the very top or among top three in just about every state when it comes to consumer complaints. And, to boot, a company that operates under more than 60 names smacks of corruption. Why do they need so many names?
I don\’t know what most of the posts mean when they use the term \”agent\’, whether it is the person who sold them the policy or the agent handling their claim. But it has been rumored that Farmer\’s gives the selling agents kick-backs for funneling clients their way. If anyone out there reading this post think you may have been treated this way by your agent, contact your State Insurance reglation department and seek the advice from a well qualified lawyer.
For all of the people who are employed by Farmers and stick by their employer . . . it is good to take pride in what do. But for those of you who do have a conscience, it will eventually catch up to you and you will see what this company really is. For those of you who don\’t have a conscience, Farmers will soon enough put the screws to you too. If you are too foolish to understand this, just check the history of Farmers and their past employees. Espescially the ones who sued Farmers for not paying them what they deserved. That alone states volumes about the character of this company.
And about taking pride in what you do . . . there is no pride ii being a rep for Farmers.
My previous post was directed to Carl Farm when it should have been in support of a post by Djean. My apologies for any confusion and/or typos in my post.
We track insurer and adjuster conduct regarding suspected fraudulent / unfair claim handling and settlement practices.
We have compelling information gathered to date (3-4-2006) from around the nation, and would invite you to review part of the information at the following link–
As you will see the different parties being sued for fraudulent conduct, and other unfair claim settlement issues, include;
FARMERS NEW CENTURY INSURANCE COMPANY,
USAA GENERAL INDEMNITY COMPANY,
ALLSTATE INSURANCE COMPANY,
HARTFORD FIRE INSURANCE COMPANY,
STATE FARM FIRE AND CASUALTY COMPANY,
TRAVELERS PROPERTY CASUALTY,
CORPORATION/TRAVELERS PROPERTY CASUALTY COMPANY OF AMERICA,
NATIONWIDE MUTUAL FIRE INSURANCE COMPANY,
OMAHA PROPERTY AND CASUALTY,
and other insurers, adjusters, FEMA-NFIP-WYO associates, claim estimating data management vendors, and many others, are named in the 2 Billion dollar (2003 Hurricane Isabel related) lawsuit.
Please feel free to contact us in regards to your own observations and research.
After 22 years w Farmers claims….I quit! They no longer trust experienced reps.. They are into data procesing, plug the numbers in and the computer spits out a number. No more more \”experienced decision making. Period!
One of my ast claims was an injury claim for an MVA where the injured party was hispanic and spoke no english. The Farmers insured was drunk when he had the loss. With a qualified interpreter I met the young man who had over $4,500 in bills. I settled the claim on the spot for $8,500. I ws repremanded, put on probation and my 22 yeas of experience amounted to ZERO. My authority was reduced to $1,500 from $10,000. All Farmers want is BA or BS degreee newbies who can data entry and stay within the programs vlue range. Exceed it and you\’re gone.
Everyone has expectations in a claims experience the \”art\” of Claims handleing is to manage those expectations. Somewhere along the line the company decided that experience means nothing and only the data formulas were relied upon.
This is not a \”Farmers Problem\” now that I am on the plaintiff side, I see adjuster after adjuster quit or move to postons that no longer require the personal touch. IT\’S AN EPIDEMIC! All companies are seeing huge turnover. I can\’t tell you how many times I hav to change contacts in order to settle or at last try to settle a claim. Ridiculous. These carriers are in lock step with Allstte and Chubb and Progressive\’s busines plans. Using the same programs, the sae scorched earth policies. Defense lawyer relief fund
1 Million is nothing!. Some day an agressive plaintif attory is going to get something in the MULTI-BILLIONS. I guarantee it!
Then they\’ll miss all the experienced reps they chased out in exchange for youger, more computer literate, cheaper, lower benifit payments due to age. I could go on but I have a vested interest. After 22 years I have a pension I\’d like to use some day. Figure that??????????????
I have been reading the posts concerning JD Power ranking of Farmers. Some of those posts, obviously posted by Farmers\’ Reps, tout Farmers as receiving the JD Power stamp of approval. One even claimed that JD Power ranked Farmers as 1st??? So giving those comments the benefit of doubt, I went to JD Power web site to see the rankings for myself. No where does it rank Farmers as #1 and in reality, the new rankings that I viewed gave Farmers a less than average rating. But that I guess is good news for Farmers employees.
If any person wants to take the time, they can do a state by state search of the insurance complaints filed for a given year. Some have that info right on the web while other states ask you to file a FOIL application. You will find the amount of complaints filed against any given insurance company and of those complaints, which were viable. Viable meaning that they were presented to that state DOI in a way that would promote their investigations. In other words, if you did not articulate in your complaint the DOI could only investigate on what you documented. If what you wrote couldn\’t be substantiated you lose. This didn\’t mean that you weren\’t wronged by your insurance company, just that you couldn\’t prove it. And unfortunately, most people can not communicate in written form that well.
So having said that, when you look at the complaints state by state, look at the total amount of complaints filed against any given company and not just the ones that the states acted on. You\’re going to find a lot of complaints, but unfortunately most of those customer complaints belong to Farmers. I know, I researched them to present in court. Kansas, Texas (regardless of what Faremers Agents state on this website)and California are among the worst rankings for Farmers. And please, be aware that Farmers operates under several different names in different states. It is important to note this when trying to accumulate this figure.
Perhaps it is as some say that Farmers are trying to change their deceitful ways.
I think not . . . no I am sure they are not.
I just had a recent run in with Farmers again. This time when one of their insured backed into my car, left the scene of the accident after I told them that the law officials were on the way. It took the police two days to find them and when they did, it was noted that this lady had tried to cover the damage to her car. She was given a ticket and had to appear in court. Still Farmers refused to pay for the damages to my car. When I talked to the Help Point Claims rep that was handling the claim she went from being a rep to a litigation specialist! That was because after telling me they weren\’t going to cover the claim I told them I had the local police re-open the investigation, put together an accident reconstruction team to testify in court where I would sue them if necessary. The next day Farmers and their claims rep/litigation specialist called from Virginia to state that they were going to pay. That they had realized their insured was lying to them. This took around two months! And yes this was recent.
If farmers is trying to improve their immage this is a very bad way to do so.
I know that this is about 6 weeks after the posting but if djean is still having problems with the FIG adjuster, I suggest he get a Texas Proof of Loss form, fill it out for policy limits, sign it before a Notary Public (both Mr. and Mrs. if married and community property, then send it by regular mail with a proof of mailing to some FIG agent in Alaska or to the address on his policy jacket. These things are mailed to Home Offices all the time and get lost. If they can\’t find it in 91 days in order to reject it, he can then file suit to execute the properly sworn Proof.
You will find that most major insurance companies have fired or put out to pasture all of the experienced people so they are now run by the opposite. FIG, for example, has raided Progressive Insurance for their \”new\” management people for their Property Claims Division. To show how smart this is, All of these Progressive people only have experience in AUTO. If anybody reads Dilbert, that has to be inspired by Farmers!
The scenero above is not a pipe dream because a person did this to Allstate many years ago and was awarded policy limits on a moderate fire.
As far as the JD Powers thing is concerned, it is a lot of hype. On one hand Farmers wants to send out and receive perfect marks on their customer surveys. The poor adjuster has to write the estimate and then print the check and all of the correspondence in the car while twisted and an unnatural angle. If the adjuster does not do this, his files will be down graded (they are audited monthly). If they pay too much, they are also downgraded. The pressure and micro management is unreal.
If the adjuster comes up against a problem situation, there is no backing whatsoever from management. You are doomed on all sides.
Although I am an adjuster of very long standing, I would recommend to anyone who has a bad property claim with Farmers to either hire a good attorney or a Public Adjuster.
After reading your description of what adjusters are subject to from their employers, I keep coming back to this question. If anyone with a moral conscience are subject to such working conditions or are forced to do something that is against their moral ethics (screw people out of their rightful claims money, put insureds through hell), why would you want to work in those types of jobs? In the most real terms, there is no excuse at all for adjusters to act this way on behalf of their employers other than that the adjusters moral ethics are just not existant or they enjoy making peoples\’lives a living hell, relagating the adjuster to less than human, a person who would turn on their own mothers for money. I know that if I were required to do those misdeeds I would be looking for employment in a different field elsewhere. In other words, what I am saying is that adjusters have a choice. It is they who make the decision to work under these conditions under those terms. These people are not being forced to do these kinds of actions, but doing them of their own free will making them culpable in any legal action against that insurer.
If adjusters truly feel the way you do and want to stay in this business, now is the time to join together, take a stand against the bad faith insurance companies/employers and bring back the respect to this industry that you say once existed.
Just recently with a State Farm adjuster, and two (ex-contractor\’s) Pilot Claim Service adjusters, who process claims for Allstate Insurance Company in the Beaumont Texas area affected by hurricane Rita, who are ALL now claiming that wind damage to shingles is not really damage.
The damage they are now disclaiming is affecting thousands of home and business owners. The damage they are disclaiming is where wind loads are so intense that the tar sealant bonds that attach one shingle to the shingle below it is lifted / broken and then wind carried debris debris collects under the shingles and DOES NOT allow shingles to thermally rebond again.
This form of wind / shingle damage is readily recognized by shingle manufacturing engineers, but until recently, now not recognized by Allstate or State Farm, at least in Texas.
I feel some insurers are intentionally defrauding their clients, and using ones like ex-contractors turned \”adjusters\” to add a veneer of ligitimacy to their claim assessment processes.
Sadly, their scheme will only play out for so long…When adjusters can earn $400.00 per day working for some con artists, they become the con\’s themselves…
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TL
I am glad that you quit FIG. What you state is probably true. It is an epidemic and one cure to this problem is for people to understand their rights and fight for them if necessary. Each state of this union has regulations that insurance companies must abide by when it comes to operating in that state. Those laws are made to protect the consumer. Unfortunatly most consumers do not even know these types of protections exist. Your claims rep, your agent or whoever are not going to tell you these laws exist because it is not in their best interest. The quickest cure would be for insurance reform instilling laws that would effectively stop and severly punish those companies for unfair practices. Lets face it. Most or all people do not understand their policies and most policies are written so that you need a Philadelphia Lawyer to decipher them for you. That is what insurance companies count on, the fact that you really don\’t know what coverage you have. They also count on the fact that you believe they work for your best interest when the truth is they work alone for themselves and the profit. Have you ever noticed the type of car your agent drives or the adjuster drives?
For those who do or are strong willed enough to fight against the wrong doing (lowballing, etc.) in the courts, the insurance company tries to delay the court process as best it can to break the plaintiffs bank or will power. And then when that doesn\’t work they want to settle.
The response from Mr. Poe to my initial post is also true. He points out that many insurance companies do in fact treat customers, when it comes to paying claims, far less than respectful. I have found some major insurance companies with less than good complaint ratios, but Farmers (aka as many other entities) continues to be at the top of the lists.
The point . . .protect yourself. Do not let the insurance companies roll over you.
The practices you describe by your adjuster were not because he was a \”newbie\”. This insurance company is noted very well for training their claims reps to do just what he did. This is SOP for this insurance company.
Two years ago our home was destroyed by fire. My experience mirrors your\’s exactly.The claims adjuster was sent in from another state (to make it more difficult to contact, would not respond to phone calls, would not respond to e-mails (the only time he did was to tell us that he could not type which by his inability to effectively communicate was proven beyond any doubt) and would not, as required in a timely fashion, submit to a arbitration. We took this to Federal Court for a non-binding arbitration and in front of a judge these FIG idiots and their lawyers defied the judge. That will prove to be fatal for them as we head off to a jury trial. This is all because FIG would not act in good faith.
The problem with Farmers is just not in California or Texas alone but all across the United States. A search of state by state insurance complaints puts Farmers at the very top or among top three in just about every state when it comes to consumer complaints. And, to boot, a company that operates under more than 60 names smacks of corruption. Why do they need so many names?
I don\’t know what most of the posts mean when they use the term \”agent\’, whether it is the person who sold them the policy or the agent handling their claim. But it has been rumored that Farmer\’s gives the selling agents kick-backs for funneling clients their way. If anyone out there reading this post think you may have been treated this way by your agent, contact your State Insurance reglation department and seek the advice from a well qualified lawyer.
For all of the people who are employed by Farmers and stick by their employer . . . it is good to take pride in what do. But for those of you who do have a conscience, it will eventually catch up to you and you will see what this company really is. For those of you who don\’t have a conscience, Farmers will soon enough put the screws to you too. If you are too foolish to understand this, just check the history of Farmers and their past employees. Espescially the ones who sued Farmers for not paying them what they deserved. That alone states volumes about the character of this company.
And about taking pride in what you do . . . there is no pride ii being a rep for Farmers.
My previous post was directed to Carl Farm when it should have been in support of a post by Djean. My apologies for any confusion and/or typos in my post.
We track insurer and adjuster conduct regarding suspected fraudulent / unfair claim handling and settlement practices.
We have compelling information gathered to date (3-4-2006) from around the nation, and would invite you to review part of the information at the following link–
http://www.femainfo.us/Links/Complaint.final.htm
As you will see the different parties being sued for fraudulent conduct, and other unfair claim settlement issues, include;
FARMERS NEW CENTURY INSURANCE COMPANY,
USAA GENERAL INDEMNITY COMPANY,
ALLSTATE INSURANCE COMPANY,
HARTFORD FIRE INSURANCE COMPANY,
STATE FARM FIRE AND CASUALTY COMPANY,
TRAVELERS PROPERTY CASUALTY,
CORPORATION/TRAVELERS PROPERTY CASUALTY COMPANY OF AMERICA,
NATIONWIDE MUTUAL FIRE INSURANCE COMPANY,
OMAHA PROPERTY AND CASUALTY,
and other insurers, adjusters, FEMA-NFIP-WYO associates, claim estimating data management vendors, and many others, are named in the 2 Billion dollar (2003 Hurricane Isabel related) lawsuit.
Please feel free to contact us in regards to your own observations and research.
rogerpoegc@yahoo.com
After 22 years w Farmers claims….I quit! They no longer trust experienced reps.. They are into data procesing, plug the numbers in and the computer spits out a number. No more more \”experienced decision making. Period!
One of my ast claims was an injury claim for an MVA where the injured party was hispanic and spoke no english. The Farmers insured was drunk when he had the loss. With a qualified interpreter I met the young man who had over $4,500 in bills. I settled the claim on the spot for $8,500. I ws repremanded, put on probation and my 22 yeas of experience amounted to ZERO. My authority was reduced to $1,500 from $10,000. All Farmers want is BA or BS degreee newbies who can data entry and stay within the programs vlue range. Exceed it and you\’re gone.
Everyone has expectations in a claims experience the \”art\” of Claims handleing is to manage those expectations. Somewhere along the line the company decided that experience means nothing and only the data formulas were relied upon.
This is not a \”Farmers Problem\” now that I am on the plaintiff side, I see adjuster after adjuster quit or move to postons that no longer require the personal touch. IT\’S AN EPIDEMIC! All companies are seeing huge turnover. I can\’t tell you how many times I hav to change contacts in order to settle or at last try to settle a claim. Ridiculous. These carriers are in lock step with Allstte and Chubb and Progressive\’s busines plans. Using the same programs, the sae scorched earth policies. Defense lawyer relief fund
1 Million is nothing!. Some day an agressive plaintif attory is going to get something in the MULTI-BILLIONS. I guarantee it!
Then they\’ll miss all the experienced reps they chased out in exchange for youger, more computer literate, cheaper, lower benifit payments due to age. I could go on but I have a vested interest. After 22 years I have a pension I\’d like to use some day. Figure that??????????????
I have been reading the posts concerning JD Power ranking of Farmers. Some of those posts, obviously posted by Farmers\’ Reps, tout Farmers as receiving the JD Power stamp of approval. One even claimed that JD Power ranked Farmers as 1st??? So giving those comments the benefit of doubt, I went to JD Power web site to see the rankings for myself. No where does it rank Farmers as #1 and in reality, the new rankings that I viewed gave Farmers a less than average rating. But that I guess is good news for Farmers employees.
If any person wants to take the time, they can do a state by state search of the insurance complaints filed for a given year. Some have that info right on the web while other states ask you to file a FOIL application. You will find the amount of complaints filed against any given insurance company and of those complaints, which were viable. Viable meaning that they were presented to that state DOI in a way that would promote their investigations. In other words, if you did not articulate in your complaint the DOI could only investigate on what you documented. If what you wrote couldn\’t be substantiated you lose. This didn\’t mean that you weren\’t wronged by your insurance company, just that you couldn\’t prove it. And unfortunately, most people can not communicate in written form that well.
So having said that, when you look at the complaints state by state, look at the total amount of complaints filed against any given company and not just the ones that the states acted on. You\’re going to find a lot of complaints, but unfortunately most of those customer complaints belong to Farmers. I know, I researched them to present in court. Kansas, Texas (regardless of what Faremers Agents state on this website)and California are among the worst rankings for Farmers. And please, be aware that Farmers operates under several different names in different states. It is important to note this when trying to accumulate this figure.
Perhaps it is as some say that Farmers are trying to change their deceitful ways.
I think not . . . no I am sure they are not.
I just had a recent run in with Farmers again. This time when one of their insured backed into my car, left the scene of the accident after I told them that the law officials were on the way. It took the police two days to find them and when they did, it was noted that this lady had tried to cover the damage to her car. She was given a ticket and had to appear in court. Still Farmers refused to pay for the damages to my car. When I talked to the Help Point Claims rep that was handling the claim she went from being a rep to a litigation specialist! That was because after telling me they weren\’t going to cover the claim I told them I had the local police re-open the investigation, put together an accident reconstruction team to testify in court where I would sue them if necessary. The next day Farmers and their claims rep/litigation specialist called from Virginia to state that they were going to pay. That they had realized their insured was lying to them. This took around two months! And yes this was recent.
If farmers is trying to improve their immage this is a very bad way to do so.
I know that this is about 6 weeks after the posting but if djean is still having problems with the FIG adjuster, I suggest he get a Texas Proof of Loss form, fill it out for policy limits, sign it before a Notary Public (both Mr. and Mrs. if married and community property, then send it by regular mail with a proof of mailing to some FIG agent in Alaska or to the address on his policy jacket. These things are mailed to Home Offices all the time and get lost. If they can\’t find it in 91 days in order to reject it, he can then file suit to execute the properly sworn Proof.
You will find that most major insurance companies have fired or put out to pasture all of the experienced people so they are now run by the opposite. FIG, for example, has raided Progressive Insurance for their \”new\” management people for their Property Claims Division. To show how smart this is, All of these Progressive people only have experience in AUTO. If anybody reads Dilbert, that has to be inspired by Farmers!
The scenero above is not a pipe dream because a person did this to Allstate many years ago and was awarded policy limits on a moderate fire.
As far as the JD Powers thing is concerned, it is a lot of hype. On one hand Farmers wants to send out and receive perfect marks on their customer surveys. The poor adjuster has to write the estimate and then print the check and all of the correspondence in the car while twisted and an unnatural angle. If the adjuster does not do this, his files will be down graded (they are audited monthly). If they pay too much, they are also downgraded. The pressure and micro management is unreal.
If the adjuster comes up against a problem situation, there is no backing whatsoever from management. You are doomed on all sides.
Although I am an adjuster of very long standing, I would recommend to anyone who has a bad property claim with Farmers to either hire a good attorney or a Public Adjuster.
Are you an adjuster with Farmers?
After reading your description of what adjusters are subject to from their employers, I keep coming back to this question. If anyone with a moral conscience are subject to such working conditions or are forced to do something that is against their moral ethics (screw people out of their rightful claims money, put insureds through hell), why would you want to work in those types of jobs? In the most real terms, there is no excuse at all for adjusters to act this way on behalf of their employers other than that the adjusters moral ethics are just not existant or they enjoy making peoples\’lives a living hell, relagating the adjuster to less than human, a person who would turn on their own mothers for money. I know that if I were required to do those misdeeds I would be looking for employment in a different field elsewhere. In other words, what I am saying is that adjusters have a choice. It is they who make the decision to work under these conditions under those terms. These people are not being forced to do these kinds of actions, but doing them of their own free will making them culpable in any legal action against that insurer.
If adjusters truly feel the way you do and want to stay in this business, now is the time to join together, take a stand against the bad faith insurance companies/employers and bring back the respect to this industry that you say once existed.
Just recently with a State Farm adjuster, and two (ex-contractor\’s) Pilot Claim Service adjusters, who process claims for Allstate Insurance Company in the Beaumont Texas area affected by hurricane Rita, who are ALL now claiming that wind damage to shingles is not really damage.
The damage they are now disclaiming is affecting thousands of home and business owners. The damage they are disclaiming is where wind loads are so intense that the tar sealant bonds that attach one shingle to the shingle below it is lifted / broken and then wind carried debris debris collects under the shingles and DOES NOT allow shingles to thermally rebond again.
This form of wind / shingle damage is readily recognized by shingle manufacturing engineers, but until recently, now not recognized by Allstate or State Farm, at least in Texas.
I feel some insurers are intentionally defrauding their clients, and using ones like ex-contractors turned \”adjusters\” to add a veneer of ligitimacy to their claim assessment processes.
Sadly, their scheme will only play out for so long…When adjusters can earn $400.00 per day working for some con artists, they become the con\’s themselves…