I understand what you are saying Aunti, and I agree. You should be allowed to state your opinion.
The difference is that Tom was stating we should be allowed to discriminate based on sexuality. That\’s where the opinion turns into hate speech. It would be the same if he were saying black people should be slaves again. When speech is used to incite harm or hate that\’s where it crosses the line.
I disagree with your premise that discriminating on sexuality is hate speech. Hate speech is inciting violence or threat of violence towards a protected class. None of protected classes are voluntary. Some studies show homosexuality may be genetic, but even if this is the case, it is still voluntarily expressed. You don\’t HAVE to have sex with same sex partners just because you are born with homosexual tendencies. Regardless of genetics, participating in homosexuality is a choice. Everyone has the option of being abstinent.
I particulary abhor the use of the \”hate speech\” card just because a person does not agree with conservative Biblical views of life. I do not cry that your denouncing of my personal religious beliefs as \”hate speech\”, why should my views be considered hate speech simply because I don\’t have the same opinion as you?
Hate speech is a controversial term for speech intended to degrade, intimidate, or incite violence or prejudicial action against a person or group of people based on their race, gender, age, ethnicity, national origin, religion, sexual orientation, gender identity, disability, language ability, moral or political views, socioeconomic class, occupation or appearance (such as height,weight, and hair color). The term covers written as well as oral communication and some forms of behaviors in a public setting. It is also sometimes called antilocution and is the first point on Allport\’s scale which measures prejudice in a society.
There ya go. And I never said anything about your personal religious beliefs. Unless of course you mean that your religous belief says we need to discriminate against people based on the above. Then, uh, yeah I guess I did. Sorry.
But that was my opinion which you defend. Understand the difference now?
I found the information below on answers.com. Unlike Troll, I do not make up definitions of words.
\”hate speech
n.
Bigoted speech attacking or disparaging a social or ethnic group or a member of such a group.\”
\”In Canada, advocating genocide or inciting hatred against any \’identifiable group\’ is an indictable offense under the Canadian Criminal Code with maximum terms of two to fourteen years. An \’identifiable group\’ is defined as \’any section of the public distinguished by colour, race, religion, ethnic origin or sexual orientation.\’ It makes exceptions for cases of statements of truth, and subjects of public debate and religious doctrine.\”
Hmm… \”I disagree with your premise that discriminating on sexuality is hate speech. Hate speech is inciting violence or threat of violence towards a protected class. None of protected classes are voluntary.\” Well, it\’s too bad you disagree but that\’s the DEFINITION. You can\’t argue with a definition unless you can get Funk & Wagnalls to change it in their reference books. Also, you say none of the protected classes are voluntary. \’I do not cry that your denouncing of my personal religious beliefs as \”hate speech\”\’ Religion is a protected class. Hmm, but religion isn\’t voluntary. Did someone FORCE you to be Christian, Methodist, Catholic? I suppose you\’re allowed to have an opinion that contradicts FACTS, but you will never be able to back that opinion up (as one would in a debate- which is essentially what we are doing).
\”Some studies show homosexuality may be genetic, but even if this is the case, it is still voluntarily expressed. You don\’t HAVE to have sex with same sex partners just because you are born with homosexual tendencies. Regardless of genetics, participating in homosexuality is a choice. Everyone has the option of being abstinent.\” Then, I ask that you please abstain. I don\’t want you procreating. (By the way, I never said anything attacking your religion. Feel free to go to church. Feel free to NOT shove your beliefs down my throat and ask me to treat a human being differently because he/she is gay.
Lastly, this just a funny little side note. My gay guy friend calls the ugly gay guys \”trolls\”. I just find that to be hysterical.
yes, many missing posts. it appears the troll and tom are the same \”person\” (sorry but can\’t call \’em human). Jewel you took the words right out of my mouth regarding hate speech, protects classes, religion and homo/hetero -sexuality. Tom, er Troll is a very uneducated person indeed. I hope he does not decide to breed.
Not sure how working with an employee who is gay can be so troubling to some people.
I worked with many gays when I was younger, we worked hard together, partied even harder together and we were all good friends.
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Sorry, rather than validity I should have said \”relevance\”. I got all fired up.
B-
Dark hole huh? ROFL. I don\’t know where you come up with this stuff but you crack me up.
Have a good evening Jewel.
I understand what you are saying Aunti, and I agree. You should be allowed to state your opinion.
The difference is that Tom was stating we should be allowed to discriminate based on sexuality. That\’s where the opinion turns into hate speech. It would be the same if he were saying black people should be slaves again. When speech is used to incite harm or hate that\’s where it crosses the line.
I disagree with your premise that discriminating on sexuality is hate speech. Hate speech is inciting violence or threat of violence towards a protected class. None of protected classes are voluntary. Some studies show homosexuality may be genetic, but even if this is the case, it is still voluntarily expressed. You don\’t HAVE to have sex with same sex partners just because you are born with homosexual tendencies. Regardless of genetics, participating in homosexuality is a choice. Everyone has the option of being abstinent.
I particulary abhor the use of the \”hate speech\” card just because a person does not agree with conservative Biblical views of life. I do not cry that your denouncing of my personal religious beliefs as \”hate speech\”, why should my views be considered hate speech simply because I don\’t have the same opinion as you?
Hate speech from the encyclopedia.
Hate speech is a controversial term for speech intended to degrade, intimidate, or incite violence or prejudicial action against a person or group of people based on their race, gender, age, ethnicity, national origin, religion, sexual orientation, gender identity, disability, language ability, moral or political views, socioeconomic class, occupation or appearance (such as height,weight, and hair color). The term covers written as well as oral communication and some forms of behaviors in a public setting. It is also sometimes called antilocution and is the first point on Allport\’s scale which measures prejudice in a society.
There ya go. And I never said anything about your personal religious beliefs. Unless of course you mean that your religous belief says we need to discriminate against people based on the above. Then, uh, yeah I guess I did. Sorry.
But that was my opinion which you defend. Understand the difference now?
I found the information below on answers.com. Unlike Troll, I do not make up definitions of words.
\”hate speech
n.
Bigoted speech attacking or disparaging a social or ethnic group or a member of such a group.\”
\”In Canada, advocating genocide or inciting hatred against any \’identifiable group\’ is an indictable offense under the Canadian Criminal Code with maximum terms of two to fourteen years. An \’identifiable group\’ is defined as \’any section of the public distinguished by colour, race, religion, ethnic origin or sexual orientation.\’ It makes exceptions for cases of statements of truth, and subjects of public debate and religious doctrine.\”
Hmm… \”I disagree with your premise that discriminating on sexuality is hate speech. Hate speech is inciting violence or threat of violence towards a protected class. None of protected classes are voluntary.\” Well, it\’s too bad you disagree but that\’s the DEFINITION. You can\’t argue with a definition unless you can get Funk & Wagnalls to change it in their reference books. Also, you say none of the protected classes are voluntary. \’I do not cry that your denouncing of my personal religious beliefs as \”hate speech\”\’ Religion is a protected class. Hmm, but religion isn\’t voluntary. Did someone FORCE you to be Christian, Methodist, Catholic? I suppose you\’re allowed to have an opinion that contradicts FACTS, but you will never be able to back that opinion up (as one would in a debate- which is essentially what we are doing).
\”Some studies show homosexuality may be genetic, but even if this is the case, it is still voluntarily expressed. You don\’t HAVE to have sex with same sex partners just because you are born with homosexual tendencies. Regardless of genetics, participating in homosexuality is a choice. Everyone has the option of being abstinent.\” Then, I ask that you please abstain. I don\’t want you procreating. (By the way, I never said anything attacking your religion. Feel free to go to church. Feel free to NOT shove your beliefs down my throat and ask me to treat a human being differently because he/she is gay.
Lastly, this just a funny little side note. My gay guy friend calls the ugly gay guys \”trolls\”. I just find that to be hysterical.
Good Morning Jewel.
Very nice post. Well said.
Have you noticed that quite a bit of our posts have been removed?
I love the irony since we were discussing free speech. :-)
yes, many missing posts. it appears the troll and tom are the same \”person\” (sorry but can\’t call \’em human). Jewel you took the words right out of my mouth regarding hate speech, protects classes, religion and homo/hetero -sexuality. Tom, er Troll is a very uneducated person indeed. I hope he does not decide to breed.
I shouldn\’t have said those things. I apologize to everyone.
Uh, okay. Another doppelganger post?
I don\’t know whether:
a) that is really Tom and he really is apologizing.
b) that is not Tom but someone thinks he should apologize
c) that is really Tom and he digs sarcasm.
I\’m hoping for a. Speaking of, B, where have you been posting at all day?
I hope everyone has a good evening.
See you tomorrow!
Not sure how working with an employee who is gay can be so troubling to some people.
I worked with many gays when I was younger, we worked hard together, partied even harder together and we were all good friends.