Scruggs isn’t lily white, but he has uncovered some less than flattering things about SF. How doyou apologists get around a pattern of abuse and PUNITIVE DAMAGES? My eyes will not shut that tightly; so as to ignore that which is so blatant. The main difference is that Scruggs is working after the fact of SF mis-deeds and SF did what they did, intentionally, knowing they were wrong!!!
State Farm denied claims. Big Whoop. Every insurance company denies claims. Insurance companies have a responsibility to their policyholders and/or shareholders to minimize losses to the “Actual Loss Sustained”. Blindly paying for any/all claims made would either drive the company out of business or drive rates up so high that no one can afford them.
There is a reason that there are so many exclusions on the normal HO policy. There are a lot of things that are either uninsurable or better covered by a different type of policy, FLOOD being the best example. Even SF’s concurrent causation clause makes sense if you look at it logically. If the adjuster is unable to determine how much damage was caused by wind because the house was razed by flood waters (storm surge), how exactly are they supposed to determine the correct amount to indemnify the wind damage?
Most insurance employees are ethical, moral people. How long do you think a company could stay in business if they constantly screwed their customers? There is enough competition out there to take advantage of any situation like that.
Mr. Freed – Please note the following FACTS, and too, try to keep in mind that you and your associates should not make claims that are not true, since that would be “perjury” in the court of public / consumer opinion, and the in the other court setting.
Too, even though it is not a new thought, please remember that ones can be illegally taken advantage of only so much anymore now that the internet exists’ and by which existance helps unlock and expose corrupt cooporations “secrets”, and the people that knowingly support them…
__________
A new twist to State Farm and Allstate’s hurricane Rita damage UNDER-assessment schemes is to (falsely) claim that wind debris damage to asphalt / fiberglass roofing system shingles, is not really damage they insure for.
They now claim that when wind borne debris (sand, pebbles, twigs, vegetation, dirt, neighbor’s roof granules, etc.) strips off shingles granular surface component, sometimes even down to the fiberglass matting, that that abrasive striping of the shingle…is not (wink-wink) reallllyy shingle damage.
Another (false) claim they both are spreading, (Allstate through Pilot Claim Service adjusters), in and around the Beaumont Texas region, and in Florida, is that the tar sealant bond that keeps one shingle attached to the one below it, is also not (wink-wink) reallllyy shingle damage when wind lift breaks the bond.
(Only naive, uneducated and tired policyholders believe, or “accept” that damaged property assessment double-speak nonsense…)
As wind loads break apart a shingle’s (factory engineered and wind warrantied) tar sealant bond, and leaves behind debris under the shingles, the heat from the sun commonly causes the debris to become attached to the tar and commonly prohibits the shingles from (thermally) sealing back together…a blatantly factual and obvious danger to the home / business structure, and to the future welfare of the inhabitants of the structure…especially along the hurricane prone Gulf Coast.
To help Allstate / Pilot Claim Service and State Farm (permanently?) correct their shingle wind damage assessment errors, and voluntarily reopen untold thousands of claims incorrectly assessed, and to help the general public receive a reasonable shingle roofing system wind damage assessment review from insurance adjusters, the following fresh technical information, received from a credible and proven shingle manufacturer, is provided for the general public;
__________
TECHNICAL BULLETIN – HURRICANE EXPOSURE
The process of detecting and evaluating damage from hurricane exposure is subjective at best, and often everyone involved may offer a different assessment.
Damage can range from wind uplift, shingle loss, broken sealant bonds, granule loss, external sources, and may not be readily apparent.
However, even small amounts of damage can harm the surfacing material, leading to deterioration of the shingles months or years later.
GRANULE LOSS
Regarding damage to the embedded granule surfacing in the asphalt top coating, hurricane wind exposure can result in varying degrees of granule loss.
Hurricane wind exposure loosens the granules, potentially allowing the granules to separate from the coating layer and wash off the roof.
Without the granule surfacing, the asphalt top coating is exposed to ultraviolet radiation from ordinary sunlight and will eventually deteriorate, exposing the fiberglass substrate and creating a leak potential.
If a shingle indicates outward damage, the underlying components may be compromised and affected to some degree.
The extent of granule loss resulting from hurricane exposure is influenced by, but not limited to, the following:
1. Age of the product.
2. Force and duration of winds and wind driven rain.
3. Type and amount of wind driven debris.
4. Orientation and slope of the deck in relation to winds.
5. Amount of foot traffic.
BROKEN SEALANT BONDS
When sealant bonds are broken due to hurricane winds, it is possible, but not likely, for shingles to reseal.
The subsequent strength of resealing, if any, would not be as strong as the initial thermal bond and would be contingent on, but not limited to, the following:
1. Age of the product.
2. Time of year and amount of exposure to ambient temperatures.
3. Length of time before shingles are exposed to subsequent high wind events.
4. Orientation and slope of deck.
5. Stress and strain on the shingles due to exposure to sustained high winds and/or deck movement.
6. Number, placement, type, and length of fasteners.
7. Contamination to the sealant bonds by dirt, debris, or other foreign substance.
8. Condition of the underlying deck or underlying shingles if a roof over.
In accordance with the terms of the limited warranty, there is no coverage for damage caused by hurricanes.
Shingles in hurricane areas will continue to carry the limited warranty for manufacturing defects and remaining limited wind warranty.
Any damage relating to conditions caused by a hurricane, including granule loss, breach of the seals, nail tears and other structural damage, will not be covered by the limited warranty or limited wind warranty at any time.
Large premiums + large deductibles + large depreciation factors + untrue loss values + irresponsible and life endangering claim loss damage assessment conduct = Minimal claim loss payouts, and Grrrreat!!! 2003, 2004, 2005, 2006, 2007 “Loss ratio” profits…
Too bad for some insurers, agents, and adjusters, that a thing called ‘Market Conduct Examinations’, periodically performed by (honest) insurance regulatory market conduct examination professionals, and others, is not going to kind to them, or to their market investment support…
Think about that the next time you see a ad from an insurer that wants you to trust them with your family’s welfare, and your money.
Make sure they do not (cleverly) steal either…
__________
For those that would like to review detailed and documented Allstate and State Farm loss claim “adjusting” misconduct that I personally witnessed with my clients, on MANY occasions, on their properties, I can be reached at-
it a rest Roger. If the wind was so strong as to unseal the shingles and lose garnules, why did it not damage the shingles in other manners? Just as tread wearing off tires is a sign of normal and espected wear, so is loss of granules a sign of normal wear. All of the shingles I (and most adjusters I have ever spoken with) have ever seen with broken seals NEVER SEALED PROPERLY FROM THE ORIGINAL INSTALLATION, due to improper installation and/or factory defect!!!
no actually that makes you incapable of comprehending the Englsih language. When you are capable of reponding to the post, rather than making it up, I would be happy to discuss it with you. I know it is hard for you not to make it up when the facts do not support your view.
State Farm has breached its own contract with its own agents. Case #C050591 Calif. Third Appellate District. That decision was final approximately April 2007 as the Calif Supreme Court refused to hear State Farm’s appeal. State Farm has yet to acknowledge this to its agents.
State Farm has was found by an Oklahoma jury to have “recklessly disregarded its duty to deal fairly with policyholders” and resulted in a $13 Million verdict.
State Farm paid $3.7 Million to settle an overtime lawsuit with approximately 400 California Claims adjusters. State Farm listed the adjusters as doing administrative work and tried to avoid paying overtime and got caught.
In the Broussard, MCoy, Nicolau and Watkins Cases the jury found for punitive damages against State Farm and used terms such as “recklessly disregarded its duty” and “intentionally and with malice”.
Now there are numerous other cases and others in the process claiming the same type of things being done to them by State Farm. How many verdicts will it take to realize there is a pattern going on here? These were juries that heard the evidence presented by both sides and found against State Farm and felt strongly enough about the evidence that they awarded punitive damages as well.
In addition to this I have the documentation of perjury by State Farm to the IRS and State Farm manufacturing evidence in another litigation. Is there anything State Farm won’t do to get their way?
I comprehend English just fine joe. I didn’t make anything up. I asked if you were a Scruggs apologist (a word that you have used in hundreds of posts, so I’m assuming you know what it means.)
Not much to discuss, & I know what your response would be anyway.
You say, “If you can’t be honest, stay off this site.”
In case you haven’t noticed, this is an insurance news web site! If YOU are not in the industry or do not know the industry (which is obvious in your post), maybe you should “stay off this site”!
We have updated our privacy policy to be more clear and meet the new requirements of the GDPR. By continuing to use our site, you accept our revised Privacy Policy.
Mark:
Scruggs isn’t lily white, but he has uncovered some less than flattering things about SF. How doyou apologists get around a pattern of abuse and PUNITIVE DAMAGES? My eyes will not shut that tightly; so as to ignore that which is so blatant. The main difference is that Scruggs is working after the fact of SF mis-deeds and SF did what they did, intentionally, knowing they were wrong!!!
So in other words you’re a Scruggs apologist.
State Farm denied claims. Big Whoop. Every insurance company denies claims. Insurance companies have a responsibility to their policyholders and/or shareholders to minimize losses to the “Actual Loss Sustained”. Blindly paying for any/all claims made would either drive the company out of business or drive rates up so high that no one can afford them.
There is a reason that there are so many exclusions on the normal HO policy. There are a lot of things that are either uninsurable or better covered by a different type of policy, FLOOD being the best example. Even SF’s concurrent causation clause makes sense if you look at it logically. If the adjuster is unable to determine how much damage was caused by wind because the house was razed by flood waters (storm surge), how exactly are they supposed to determine the correct amount to indemnify the wind damage?
Most insurance employees are ethical, moral people. How long do you think a company could stay in business if they constantly screwed their customers? There is enough competition out there to take advantage of any situation like that.
Mr. Freed – Please note the following FACTS, and too, try to keep in mind that you and your associates should not make claims that are not true, since that would be “perjury” in the court of public / consumer opinion, and the in the other court setting.
Too, even though it is not a new thought, please remember that ones can be illegally taken advantage of only so much anymore now that the internet exists’ and by which existance helps unlock and expose corrupt cooporations “secrets”, and the people that knowingly support them…
__________
A new twist to State Farm and Allstate’s hurricane Rita damage UNDER-assessment schemes is to (falsely) claim that wind debris damage to asphalt / fiberglass roofing system shingles, is not really damage they insure for.
They now claim that when wind borne debris (sand, pebbles, twigs, vegetation, dirt, neighbor’s roof granules, etc.) strips off shingles granular surface component, sometimes even down to the fiberglass matting, that that abrasive striping of the shingle…is not (wink-wink) reallllyy shingle damage.
Another (false) claim they both are spreading, (Allstate through Pilot Claim Service adjusters), in and around the Beaumont Texas region, and in Florida, is that the tar sealant bond that keeps one shingle attached to the one below it, is also not (wink-wink) reallllyy shingle damage when wind lift breaks the bond.
(Only naive, uneducated and tired policyholders believe, or “accept” that damaged property assessment double-speak nonsense…)
As wind loads break apart a shingle’s (factory engineered and wind warrantied) tar sealant bond, and leaves behind debris under the shingles, the heat from the sun commonly causes the debris to become attached to the tar and commonly prohibits the shingles from (thermally) sealing back together…a blatantly factual and obvious danger to the home / business structure, and to the future welfare of the inhabitants of the structure…especially along the hurricane prone Gulf Coast.
To help Allstate / Pilot Claim Service and State Farm (permanently?) correct their shingle wind damage assessment errors, and voluntarily reopen untold thousands of claims incorrectly assessed, and to help the general public receive a reasonable shingle roofing system wind damage assessment review from insurance adjusters, the following fresh technical information, received from a credible and proven shingle manufacturer, is provided for the general public;
__________
TECHNICAL BULLETIN – HURRICANE EXPOSURE
The process of detecting and evaluating damage from hurricane exposure is subjective at best, and often everyone involved may offer a different assessment.
Damage can range from wind uplift, shingle loss, broken sealant bonds, granule loss, external sources, and may not be readily apparent.
However, even small amounts of damage can harm the surfacing material, leading to deterioration of the shingles months or years later.
GRANULE LOSS
Regarding damage to the embedded granule surfacing in the asphalt top coating, hurricane wind exposure can result in varying degrees of granule loss.
Hurricane wind exposure loosens the granules, potentially allowing the granules to separate from the coating layer and wash off the roof.
Without the granule surfacing, the asphalt top coating is exposed to ultraviolet radiation from ordinary sunlight and will eventually deteriorate, exposing the fiberglass substrate and creating a leak potential.
If a shingle indicates outward damage, the underlying components may be compromised and affected to some degree.
The extent of granule loss resulting from hurricane exposure is influenced by, but not limited to, the following:
1. Age of the product.
2. Force and duration of winds and wind driven rain.
3. Type and amount of wind driven debris.
4. Orientation and slope of the deck in relation to winds.
5. Amount of foot traffic.
BROKEN SEALANT BONDS
When sealant bonds are broken due to hurricane winds, it is possible, but not likely, for shingles to reseal.
The subsequent strength of resealing, if any, would not be as strong as the initial thermal bond and would be contingent on, but not limited to, the following:
1. Age of the product.
2. Time of year and amount of exposure to ambient temperatures.
3. Length of time before shingles are exposed to subsequent high wind events.
4. Orientation and slope of deck.
5. Stress and strain on the shingles due to exposure to sustained high winds and/or deck movement.
6. Number, placement, type, and length of fasteners.
7. Contamination to the sealant bonds by dirt, debris, or other foreign substance.
8. Condition of the underlying deck or underlying shingles if a roof over.
In accordance with the terms of the limited warranty, there is no coverage for damage caused by hurricanes.
Shingles in hurricane areas will continue to carry the limited warranty for manufacturing defects and remaining limited wind warranty.
Any damage relating to conditions caused by a hurricane, including granule loss, breach of the seals, nail tears and other structural damage, will not be covered by the limited warranty or limited wind warranty at any time.
TB-420 2/24/06
ELK P.O. Box 500 Ennis, TX. 75120
Toll Free – 1-866-355-8324 http://www.elkcorp.com
__________
Large premiums + large deductibles + large depreciation factors + untrue loss values + irresponsible and life endangering claim loss damage assessment conduct = Minimal claim loss payouts, and Grrrreat!!! 2003, 2004, 2005, 2006, 2007 “Loss ratio” profits…
Too bad for some insurers, agents, and adjusters, that a thing called ‘Market Conduct Examinations’, periodically performed by (honest) insurance regulatory market conduct examination professionals, and others, is not going to kind to them, or to their market investment support…
Think about that the next time you see a ad from an insurer that wants you to trust them with your family’s welfare, and your money.
Make sure they do not (cleverly) steal either…
__________
For those that would like to review detailed and documented Allstate and State Farm loss claim “adjusting” misconduct that I personally witnessed with my clients, on MANY occasions, on their properties, I can be reached at-
rogerpoegc@yahoo.com
Oh roger thank you you have your eyes open. your a A+
it a rest Roger. If the wind was so strong as to unseal the shingles and lose garnules, why did it not damage the shingles in other manners? Just as tread wearing off tires is a sign of normal and espected wear, so is loss of granules a sign of normal wear. All of the shingles I (and most adjusters I have ever spoken with) have ever seen with broken seals NEVER SEALED PROPERLY FROM THE ORIGINAL INSTALLATION, due to improper installation and/or factory defect!!!
no actually that makes you incapable of comprehending the Englsih language. When you are capable of reponding to the post, rather than making it up, I would be happy to discuss it with you. I know it is hard for you not to make it up when the facts do not support your view.
State Farm has breached its own contract with its own agents. Case #C050591 Calif. Third Appellate District. That decision was final approximately April 2007 as the Calif Supreme Court refused to hear State Farm’s appeal. State Farm has yet to acknowledge this to its agents.
State Farm has was found by an Oklahoma jury to have “recklessly disregarded its duty to deal fairly with policyholders” and resulted in a $13 Million verdict.
State Farm paid $3.7 Million to settle an overtime lawsuit with approximately 400 California Claims adjusters. State Farm listed the adjusters as doing administrative work and tried to avoid paying overtime and got caught.
In the Broussard, MCoy, Nicolau and Watkins Cases the jury found for punitive damages against State Farm and used terms such as “recklessly disregarded its duty” and “intentionally and with malice”.
Now there are numerous other cases and others in the process claiming the same type of things being done to them by State Farm. How many verdicts will it take to realize there is a pattern going on here? These were juries that heard the evidence presented by both sides and found against State Farm and felt strongly enough about the evidence that they awarded punitive damages as well.
In addition to this I have the documentation of perjury by State Farm to the IRS and State Farm manufacturing evidence in another litigation. Is there anything State Farm won’t do to get their way?
I comprehend English just fine joe. I didn’t make anything up. I asked if you were a Scruggs apologist (a word that you have used in hundreds of posts, so I’m assuming you know what it means.)
Not much to discuss, & I know what your response would be anyway.
Ma Barker, et al,
You say, “If you can’t be honest, stay off this site.”
In case you haven’t noticed, this is an insurance news web site! If YOU are not in the industry or do not know the industry (which is obvious in your post), maybe you should “stay off this site”!