FDNY protocols need to be reviewed for sure. This building was allowed to stand following 9/11 for reasons unknown. It was condemned and should have been razed when doing so wouldn’t have added any additional pollutants into the air than were already present. It was vacant and there was no reason to have an operative standpipe. Nor was there any reason to send firefighters up there. No property or life was in danger and the fire would have burned itself out. Instead, two men are dead because of a protocol that says “when there’s a fire we must go in and put it out.”
Notwithstanding the above, firefighting is a dangerous business and a major assumption of risk. Nobody can guarantee the safety of firefighters. It will be interesting to see how much “guilt money” the city and state throw at the estates to get rid of these suits. I certainly won’t be worth anything near $180MM. Firemen aren’t the most highly compensated people so even with a career expectancy of another 30 years at $80K per year their lost earnings amount to $1.8MM after taxes.
I see no merit whatever to these claims. Danger and posssible injury and death go with the territory. That’s tough but that’s the way it is. It would be like a soldier’s family suing the government for his combat death. Like I said, it goes with the territory.
The posts to date have referred to the so-called “firemans’ rule” by which a fireman or policeman who is injured or killed in the line of duty has no legal basis for filing a liability claim against the entity for whom they were fighting the fire or acting as authority, and neither do their relatives. I know that the rule has gone out of favor in the Courts of late, but I didn’t think it had been totally outmoded. I’m not without sympathy for the folks who are injured or killed in the line of duty but surely municipalities and workers comp carriers have worked this out long ago.
I agree. The government should never be liable to it’s people.! If your hurt because of their negligence. So what? you shouldn’t have any rights as you knew what you were doing whenever you signed up! Yeah this will be my philosophy from this point forward. It’s so freeing to know that the government is not liable to its people under any circumstances. Just pay them your tax money, they’ll take care of you and if it doesnt work out, well……you should’ve known better. Right?
That’s not really the point. There are inherent risks in fire fighting that are accepted when you join the profession. Dying in a fire is one of those risks. That’s not so say the government can’t and shouldn’t be held liable for negligence, but that the government should not be held liable for the normal risks of a given profession.
It was stupid to keep the building up. It was stupid to have the building up and shut off water to a stand-pipe. It was stupid to try and save a building that was coming down anyway. But that doesn’t mean the government owes millions.
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FDNY protocols need to be reviewed for sure. This building was allowed to stand following 9/11 for reasons unknown. It was condemned and should have been razed when doing so wouldn’t have added any additional pollutants into the air than were already present. It was vacant and there was no reason to have an operative standpipe. Nor was there any reason to send firefighters up there. No property or life was in danger and the fire would have burned itself out. Instead, two men are dead because of a protocol that says “when there’s a fire we must go in and put it out.”
Notwithstanding the above, firefighting is a dangerous business and a major assumption of risk. Nobody can guarantee the safety of firefighters. It will be interesting to see how much “guilt money” the city and state throw at the estates to get rid of these suits. I certainly won’t be worth anything near $180MM. Firemen aren’t the most highly compensated people so even with a career expectancy of another 30 years at $80K per year their lost earnings amount to $1.8MM after taxes.
I see no merit whatever to these claims. Danger and posssible injury and death go with the territory. That’s tough but that’s the way it is. It would be like a soldier’s family suing the government for his combat death. Like I said, it goes with the territory.
Yeah, right! Eli has it correct: $80k for about 20 years should oughta do it.
Now, from that $80K/yr, subtract whatever life insurance and other compensation are received by the families as a direct result of their losses.
I know this is considered heartless, but as was said, the danger goes with the territory.
The posts to date have referred to the so-called “firemans’ rule” by which a fireman or policeman who is injured or killed in the line of duty has no legal basis for filing a liability claim against the entity for whom they were fighting the fire or acting as authority, and neither do their relatives. I know that the rule has gone out of favor in the Courts of late, but I didn’t think it had been totally outmoded. I’m not without sympathy for the folks who are injured or killed in the line of duty but surely municipalities and workers comp carriers have worked this out long ago.
I agree. The government should never be liable to it’s people.! If your hurt because of their negligence. So what? you shouldn’t have any rights as you knew what you were doing whenever you signed up! Yeah this will be my philosophy from this point forward. It’s so freeing to know that the government is not liable to its people under any circumstances. Just pay them your tax money, they’ll take care of you and if it doesnt work out, well……you should’ve known better. Right?
That’s not really the point. There are inherent risks in fire fighting that are accepted when you join the profession. Dying in a fire is one of those risks. That’s not so say the government can’t and shouldn’t be held liable for negligence, but that the government should not be held liable for the normal risks of a given profession.
It was stupid to keep the building up. It was stupid to have the building up and shut off water to a stand-pipe. It was stupid to try and save a building that was coming down anyway. But that doesn’t mean the government owes millions.